Palestine Discussion with Jimmy Carter and Munib Younan (Nov. 12, 2007)

Palestine Discussion with Jimmy Carter and Munib Younan (Nov. 12, 2007)

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The Carter Center hosted a discussion Nov. 12, 2007 with former U.S. President Jimmy Carter and the Rev. Munib Younan, bishop of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Jordan and the Occupied Palestinian Territory, on the situation in the West Bank and prospects for peace in the Middle East.  The dialogue followed the screening of "Jimmy Carter: Man From Plains," which documents President Carter's 2006 "Palestine Peace Not Apartheid" book tour.

Founded in 1982 by former U.S. President Jimmy Carter and former First Lady Rosalynn Carter in partnership with Emory University, The Carter Center is committed to advancing human rights and alleviating unnecessary human suffering. The Center wages peace, fights disease, and builds hope worldwide.

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thank you very much we are so appreciative as I said at the beginning for your coming out this evening it's a

very special occasion for all of us we're going to have the chance to hear from President Carter himself to talk to

us about his views what has happened maybe since the film that he can share

was filmed about a year ago what has happened prospects for peace from his

view and we also have a very special guest with us this evening we want to

hear from him he is the bishop from the Lutheran Bishop of the Holy Land from

Jerusalem the Reverend Bishop Yunnan is the Bishop of the Evangelical Lutheran

Church in Jordan and the Holy Land an outspoken advocate of peace with justice

in the Holy Land the Bishop continually challenges Christians to stand up and raise their prophetic voices to be

witnesses for justice and non-violence and ministers of peace and

reconciliation in the Holy Land he is also vice president of the Lutheran

World Federation president of the fellowship of Middle East evangelical churches chair of the Augusta Victoria

hospital board chair of local reference group for the ecumenical accompaniment program in Palestine and Israel and an

active member of the Middle East Council of Churches Executive Committee he has a

leader in interfaith dialogue with Christians Muslims and Jews and as the

author of the book witnessing for peace and many articles speeches and lectures on religion politics and peace building

in the Middle East I hope he'll talk to you about a mission he's been on this last week to Washington DC with an inter-religious

group of the chief rabbis from Israel the leading Islamic leader and fought the five principal Christian leaders

from the the city of Jerusalem they were here together to talk about peace and he says why are Christians leaving the Holy

Land what will it take to finally reach a lasting peace in the Middle East bishop muna you none of the ALDC jhl

will share his perspective with us tonight as a Palestinian refugee who now

the only Palestinian Lutheran Church in the Holy Land he will discuss the future of

Palestinian Christianity in the midst of Israeli occupation and prospects for

peace with justice in this troubled region I would like to welcome to the stage President Carter and Bishop muniya

Bunin

we will take questions after each has made some comments and as I pointed out

if you will pass your questions to the end I will collect them now since the

movie was just over I think I've dog we we can start with your questions about the film

I hope this has not caused any of you would be authors not to publish your book because you don't want to go on a

book tour this is not typical book tour but it's a very exciting way for me now having

finished 25 books I just finished the one that come out next year it's a biography of my mother but it gives me a

chance to go out on the kind of a campaign trail and promulgate my ideas

about different aspects of of world affairs and also domestic affairs so I

think the first thing we do is maybe to have any questions that you might have about the film about about the Mideast

from an American perspective and in reach the high point of our evening of an Bishop your nine world I tell you

about what's going on now in Palestine in Jerusalem and his notable efforts

which we discussed this afternoon to bring together the peace-loving people

who happen to be Jewish or Christian or Muslim so if you have any questions now

about the film we'll do those first sir the written questions may we might not be able to categorize them that way so

I'm gonna ask anyone with questions about the film to go ahead and raise your hand we'll improvise here a little

bit if anyone had a question couple of questions about the film and then if you

can just speak up if you have nice loud voices I think we'll catch it thanks right here right here

yes you Stanly yes we were hoping when we heard

that there was going to be a movie that it would be about the whole gamut for issues in which the Carter Center is

involved and not concentrate just on the one book with some you know kind of a

peripheral films of a guinea worm and other things because Rosa and I

organized a quarter son of 25 years ago we're now in 271 countries in the world

35 in Africa we deal with neglected diseases and and and and hold Nepal to

hell I think now 68 elections in different parts of the world all trouble elections and so forth erosion has a

nationwide a global mental health program so we were hoping that the film would encompass a more broad-based

picture of our lives and not just this particular effort but I think that Jonathan Demme II who had complete

control over the film we had no control over what was shown or has done a very good job in and you know giving this

particular issue great dramatic presentation back here I'm gonna be Phil

Donahue for a moment here you mentioned

in the film several times that you felt like the press was biased and I wondered if you could speak to what is the

motivation or the payoff or the hidden agenda for the press and also for the Christian Right in this country to not

be willing to deal with the reality of what's happening well I don't really

blame the press the press has to cover what is going on you know in government and then other arenas of life I don't

believe you've heard a single candidate for president on the Republican or Democratic side address any of the

issues that are presented in his film if you have I missed it

and you will never hear any member of Congress make any comment about Palestinian rights or about Israel

withdrawing to the international borders or things are bad kind so the press

basically covers what is in the you know political debates and what's going on

within the Congress and what's going on between candidates who are running for office the last thing that I ever have

believed though is that the the press is somehow controlled by any particular faction in America this is not the case

I grew up in Georgia where the press is dominant press in Atlanta and so forth

has been controlled by the Klux family and my mother my first cousin Don Carter

was very active with knight-ridder and with the Wall Street Journal and my wife Rosen was only canet board that founded

USA Today none of those are controlled by Jewish interests for instance so that's that's certainly not to be

assumed but the freshest covers what goes on among the debaters in America

and and this is almost a taboo subject I think that one of the I had two subjects

two proposals in mind when I wrote the book one was to try to precipitate more

effort to bring peace to Israel and its neighbors at this moment for seven years

there has not been one single day of substantive peace talks between Israel

and the Palestinians or Syria and so forth and now there is a scheduled

meeting they don't call it a discussion or a debate or negotiation our meeting it's got to be held before the end of

this year if plans go forward in Annapolis and that's a very good development I hope it'll be successful

and the other thing was just to precipitate a debate in our country and I think that the book has done that but

I don't blame the press it's just that the press is covering what's happening

yes sir how could we can get a copy of this how could we can get a copy of this

film to show the community at large well Sony has bought the film rights

Jonathan Demme II no longer controls the films but my understanding is that there will be DVDs available after the film is

shown in the theaters around the nation and then the DVD will be not only the

film but but much more extensive background information things that couldn't be included in a two-hour film

so it will be available in much more definitive status within a few months I

don't know exactly the schedule but it'll be available to anyone showing here in Atlanta so you could take your group to the theater maybe my first

question have been answered but I just want to say on behalf of the American Palestinian community and American Arab

community you are the best of America and I wish your theme of human rights

around the world will continue we salute you and thank you

when I was watching the film I was much impressed by the way that you kept your energy level up and you're in health and

as an activist I'm interested in knowing how you keep and I know that that you're

praying is is very important in reading the Bible but but physically how do you

keep in physical shape to for such a rigorous schedule issue you might not

have noticed but I swam well all my life

I've been a long-distance runner in fact when I was president many states I ran about 40 miles a week which did a lot of

running but I had to give up running because I had a needed swelled up when I

was 80 years old so the last three years I haven't run but we still ride bikes and we swim every day and Rosen I take

long walks and Rosen is an expert on nutrition so at least when we're at home

we eat exactly the right thing with exactly the amount in the right amount of carbohydrates and everything else and

so and we've just been lucky you know with so far with our health I hope it'll

prevail for a few more years but we've been lucky with that but a lot of the

time on film because I couldn't act because Jonathan Demi and his crew sometimes but three cameras focused on

my face from different directions in the same automobile with with me 16 hours a day

for others so it wasn't any way to put on false airs but I have to say this

sometimes I was maybe tired or then I appeared on film

it's an exhausting thing but you know I start out sometime in the morning before I leave the hotel room I'll do 24 radio

interviews 10 minutes each start on the east coast say at 6 o'clock in the

morning and wind up on the west coast at 9 o'clock and never know what Nina's

body's going to ask and a lot of the people that ask questions have never read my book or any other book

 they

interfere they interrupt their bribe all discussion with each other and then they're playing of music to ask a

question about a book they've never heard officer but anyway 

a lot of my own the other hand know a lot about it but

so that's that's kind of a discipline for promoting above it's a normal but

this is not quite a normal book to it but a normal book tour is still what I just described this is more

controversial but but obviously but exciting more exciting and I told I've

told Rosen right that I really enjoyed and appreciated the the intense debate

and the controversy that was aroused what I didn't like of course was a personal attacks but I as I said in the

film well to the students at Brandeis I can take it you know it doesn't bother me already maybe one more question thank

you for your courage on this it seems that the in the Mideast the use of

nuclear weapons is a great fear that's shared by many of the nations there have

you thought of speaking out more strongly on these issues and perhaps

with former senator Sam Nunn and former ambassador Jim Laney right here at home yes every five years at least at the

Carter Center we have a definitive meeting prior to the discussion of the

non-proliferation treaty in that treaty there is a commitment from all countries

led by the United States completed to eliminate nuclear weapons from the face

of earth and constantly to reduce the level of nuclear armaments

unfortunately in the last six years or so our government has rejected every

single nuclear arms control agreement ever negotiated since the time of Dwight

Eisenhower and so we try to gather here about 25 or 30 nations all of whom are

technologically capable of producing nuclear weapons themselves these are countries like Argentina or Brazil or

Egypt or Saudi Arabia or obviously such as like Switzerland or Austria about 30

of them and they come here to prepare themselves to go to the legally required

discussion at the General Assembly of the United Nations to say how are we failing to honor the nuclear arms or the

non-proliferation treaty and it's a very sad commentary on current times but we

understand that threat everybody in the Mideast knows that Israel has a very

large nuclear arsenal and there's a

great deal of suspicion that Iran ultimately would like to have nuclear weapons themselves recently President

Mubarak in Egypt last week announced that Egypt is is developing now will

develop our nuclear reactors that can

produce fuel so it's a rate threat the only way to prevent it is for the United

States to take the leadership role as they did under every previous president

I would say since the second world war and until this administration and I have

every five years I write an op-ed piece in editorial that that is published in

The New York Times or The Washington Post and then we sent it out to about 30 international newspapers I wrote an

op-ed piece just a few weeks ago condemning the agreement

between the United States and India where the United States has agreed to

sell India not only nuclear weapons material but also technology that would

make it possible for them to produce nuclear weapons since India is not a signatory of the non-proliferation

treaty it's just about just four countries in the world that have refused

to sign the non-proliferation treaty India is one of them and I have never thought that we ought to sell any

nuclear capabilities to nations no matter how friendly they might be unless they were willing to comply with the

restraints so we do what we can hit the Carter Center but but I can't say that we under leadership but I worked very

closely with Sam Nunn and with others that have joined with him in a tepid

Henry Kissinger's one of one of them and George Shultz who's former Secretary of

State under President Reagan 

and and I have cooperated in their effort and now

it's time for us to turn to the to the headline of the evening and to the high point of the evening and that is to

listen to Bishop you know I tell us what he is doing and what his status is and

and a great effort that he's making to bring a theological as well as a

practical approach to promoting peace in the Holy Land we're glad to have you

here with us 

Thank You mr. president and

I would like first of all to thank you for your prophetic role that you are

playing at the moment and I'm always saying you see that we need at the

moment charismatic leaders that speak truth to power not people who are

politicians who only beat around the bush

we need a as I understand the book you know that you have written I understand

it in a different way than many President Carter is telling

the world if you love the State of Israel and want its content and want its

continuity in the Middle East help Israel to end the occupation and help

Israel not to become apartheid and I think you know this message is not

nowadays heard and anybody who sneaks his head outside a certain room then he

has all kinds of stigmatization so mr. president you are welcome to the club

that we are always in it I would like to say this book is telling us all what I

would like to say we don't want the people to be prepared as Tinian but we

don't want them also to be pro-israeli we want the people in the United States

of America to be pro justice Pro truth pro peace Pro reconciliation Pro

forgiveness Pro Human Rights pro-life and that's a church we have to hear this

message more and more for me I believe

occupation is a sin against God and against humanity because it deprives the

other their own human rights and dignity when we call as a church and the illegal

occupation we are saying very clearly that we want to liberate Israel and the

Palestinians from the sin of occupation because we believe that the security of

Israel is only dependent on the freedom and justice of the Palestinians and the

freedom and justice of the Palestinian are only dependent on the security of Israel there is no other formula in the

Middle East than this formula I would like to say it seems that the

palestinian-israeli conflict is now not only the core problem of the Middle East

but it's the core problem of the whole world if the world wants justice and

peace let it must start from Jerusalem not from Baghdad and I would like also

to say if the world the Arab and Muslim world are looking to the United States

of America with big eyes for the litmus test for the Arab world can the United

States of America use one standard for justice in the

Middle East and can they bring justice and peace to the palestinian-israeli

conflict this is really the challenge when we as a church many at times

working for justice we are asked why are you a politician I'm almost always

saying working for justice is not only

political it's spiritual for me it's biblical for I mean when

somebody when one of my teachers in Beit Sahour comes and tell me God is a real

estate broker God is one-sided God does

not love us Palestinians what do I tell these people or she told me one of my

teachers last night I don't believe anymore in God for God is only with one

people against us I thought what do you mean ma'am she told me last night my home fence was

transferred to 8 meter 24 feet wall I can no more see the landscape I can see

only the sky and my house and the ugly concrete wall where is God or another

girl narrations tomb she told her mother she is 13 years old why did God allow us

to live in a tomb for me we have to show

the Palestinian people when working for justice that God is a God of justice and

that God is an ever embracing love of

God he loves also the Palestinians as he loves the Israelis and as he loves the

the Americans that message when we work for justice we want to secure it for our

people the Palestinians we are now looking with big hopes to Annapolis they

call it's a meeting they call it's a consultation whatever they call it we

don't care we want justice we want justice and we want them to deal now

with the root cause of the problem with the real issues we don't want only nice

smiles we want really as President Carter did in 1979 he dealt with the

real issues and this is the reason justice and peace could be implemented

between Egypt and Syria however what we want we want the issue of Jerusalem to

be dealt Jerusalem must be shared it must be Jewish Christian Muslim

Palestinian Israeli any missing of these elements there will be no peace in the

Middle East we want a two-state solution on 1967

living side by side with each other we want the right of return of refugees to

be politically dealt with I am a refugee I don't want after 20 years that my

grandchild will tell me oh you have been a coward you couldn't deal our right of return we want also the settlement

policy to stop and we want not only to share the land we want also to share

water and resources if these are dealt in Annapolis any president who we can't

do it anybody who can do it then they deserve the real Nobel price from all of

us not only from Oslo there is no other

way except this way unfortunately at this moment there is a very high

immigration on the side of the Palestinian Christians many people are

saying Palestinian Christians are escaping from Palestine because they are persecuted by the Muslims I want to

settle very frankly we Palestinian Christians are not persecuted neither by

the PA nor by the Muslims nor in Israel

Palestinian Christians are immigrating because of occupation and occupation

drives them to leave the country unfortunately at the moment there are

two there are less than 2% of the total population and if that trend continues

then we are afraid that there will be no more Christians no more living stones in

the in the Holy Land I tell you the future of Christianity in

the Middle East is not under occupation nor in war

nor it is under extremism the future of Palestinian Christianity in Palestine

and Israel is only in a just peace our people will come back if just peace come

because at the moment there are more Palestinian Christians in Detroit and Chicago and Houston and so on then they

are existing in Palestine itself and this is shame that the Palestinian

Christian Church that the Christian churches in the world are not taking that into consideration

I don't want after 15 years to come to ask you to come to the country and then

find there some good bishops some good monks some good nuns some some churches

and holy places but no living human beings living stones please allow

Palestinian Christians to stay in the country I am really happy to tell you

that there are many most Muslim and Jewish colonists in the world that are

writing what is an Arab and Muslim world without Arab Palestinian Christianity

and they even wrote there to write these things that the guarantees for the Arab

Christianity and Palestinian Christianity are the guarantees for

democracy and building a civil society in the whole Arab world please do your

utmost to help us in a just peace to stay in the country we can only stay

when there is just peace it doesn't mean we are weaker but I can understand the

needs of many Palestinian Christians who need passes to come to to a place or I cannot gather my Synod or my my church

elders or our congregation members to have meetings in Bethlehem or in

Jerusalem or another or another if I have to take them to Jordan because this

is easy to pass there and it's more expensive where is the world we Christians want to

live in dignity as every Palestinian Muslim and as everybody wants to live

many are telling that at the moment extremism is growing and usually I am

saying yes extremism is growing and we

have to be careful and be fair in our judgement when we speak nowadays on

extremism we always pinpoint on Islamic extremism but we forget Christian

extremism and we forget Jewish extremism and they are all as good as each other

because I want to tell you we have Christians to clean our dirty kitchen

before we ask other religions to clean the dirty lounges and the Christian

kitchen is very dirty the Christian Right are not rendering any service

neither to the Jews nor to the palace nor to the Christians nor to the Muslims

nor / to the Palestinians nor to the Israelis nor to the Americans they are

driving the American Society into a culture of militarization and they are

driving the whole Middle East into a culture of injustice and confrontation

please and in scenarios that come from

eschatological biblical understanding they are scenarios that are not

realistic and they are far from our scripture and far what from what our

Lord and Savior Jesus Christ has taught us these scenarios and all the scenarios

of war scenarios of Armageddon scenarios of may King My Christ being a Christ of this

world and bring Christ of the earth of killing and violence my Christ is always

the Christ of the cross and never the Christ of war and this is the reason

this is the only Christ that I can offer to my work this is the the Christ of the

cross for this reason these extremism what they are offering to us it's very

dangerous and we have together with the American people to stop that kind of

false teaching or even sick ideology the Islamic also the extremism is also

dangerous which also promotes violence and which also promotes that the whole

world must have must be Islamic Islamist and there must have on one khalifa this

is not acceptable and they can use any means in order to determine to

dehumanize and demonize others we have clearly to speak against any kind of

Islamic extremism that promotes violence or terrorism or anything because our

role has Christian Church and as people of faith is only to speak for life

Jewish extremism is also dangerous that call for a transfer of Palestinians from

their country into some other countries as long as as one has said we want to

transfer them to Bulgaria I don't want to leave Jerusalem I have been a refugee

I'm a refugee from Beersheba and I am proud to be a refugee even if I am

oppressed but I would nobody will drive me out of Jerusalem this Jerusalem is

not my Jerusalem this Jerusalem is our Jerusalem and we have to take good care

of our Jerusalem we want our Jerusalem we want our our Jerusalem to be a

Jerusalem that is inclusive for everybody as I have told Condoleezza

Rice weeks ago when we met her in Jerusalem that extremism cannot be combatted

by shelling on bombing extremism can be combated only by education and by

prophetic interfaith dialogue and I want to tell you that education as I have

spoken with the chief rabbis of Israel and with the Islamic leadership only

education that promotes hate free text is the only education we want to give in

Palestine and to Israel to our children we have to clean our curricula in

Palestine and Israel from any hatred towards the other because nobody is pure

and clean and that is very important for promoting a new generation that that

knows how to live with the other religion and that knows how to live in

justice and peace with the other and respect the other interfaith dialogue is

very important and I want to tell you we have established for the first time in

history the Council for religious leadership in the Holy Land this is for

it consists of the two chief rabbis it consists of the Islamic leadership and

and the heads of the local churches I want to tell you this council wants to

deal with issues that are very dear to to all of us this council is a hope for

us to be prophetic at this time when we notice that religion has become part of

problem we want to tell the world that religion is part of the solution you

have the paper in front of you the communique if you want to read it but I want to end with this remark what we

want you to help us help us to bring justice and peace to the Middle East we

don't want the American administration to leave its traditional ally Israel but

we want the United States of America to have another traditional ally with who

who are the Palestinians two allies are better than one and I want to end I am

only dreaming for a day and I hope is today that my pal that we Palestinians

can see God in the Israelis and that the

Israelis can see God in us the Palestinians and that we can accept each

other humanities and that we can mutually recognize each other human

civil religious political and national rights only then the Holy Land will

become a land of milk and honey for both Palestinians and Israelis may God bless

you

we have a few minutes for questions Bishop you know and that was wonderful thank you so much sure you can join us

on the on the stage for questions President Carter there's a couple for you if you wanted to answer any the

first question to President Carter is have you had the chance

since the bishop raised the issue of the the Christian Right have you had the chance to discuss the book Palestine

peace not apartheid with any of members of the Christian Zionist community in general have you found ways with this group to

the bishop do you think that trying to change the

Hamas government control of the Gaza Strip is a first step in promoting peace

in the region if not what would be the first step well

I would like first of all to say that when we look at the issue of Hamas we

have not to deal with it to pick it up from the box and choose it and forgot

forget the whole context Hamas did not come to power out of the moon

they came to power because of the frustration of the people yes there was

corruption on the side of Fateh we know we don't we don't deny it but they came

because the people are frustrated and as long as there is frustration these extremists will win ground the first

step is to bring justice once you bring justice once the occupation ends once

the Palestinians have that their state on 67 board alongside the State of

Israel living in peace and justice I promise you Hamas will no more will only

the motorist then will win and this is the reason the first step is and the

illegal occupation thank you why do so many of the players in the

Middle East say that for there to be peace the American government has to take the lead is it because there is so

much money in play and interests you

answer that yes well I think you know

history has taught us that the peace that was between Egypt and Israel was

only led by the United States of America by President Jimmy Carter the superpower

at the moment who can bring peace to the Middle East

is only the United States of America and for this reason I believe that the

United States of America has to be an honest broker at the moment if the

United States of America looks at it at its interest in the Middle East

I think its interests are both with Israel and with the Arab and Muslim

world and for this reason they can do it

and implement it as a super world we know very well that Aurora you cannot do it without the United States

of America we have to speak on realpolitik however I would like to say

that it's better now that united state leads and least charismatic Lee and

prophetically both Palestinians and Israelis who are incapable together to

do it without the United States of America otherwise if United state doesn't lead

I'm afraid somebody else will lead that nobody likes it the opinion is there any hope

of removing the Israeli settlements from the West Bank well I think you know the

Israeli settlement first of all the policy there must be a policy to end

settlements from the West Bank and and because I want to say very clearly the

settlements aren't built on confiscated Palestinian land they are not built in

Israel proper if they are built in this soil property are welcomed to it too to be there now there are two options or

three options or whatever options the political negotiations should really

take place one of them either to leave them and to withdraw from them and at

the same time to allow the Palestinian refugees from Lebanon for example to live in them they are 450,000 why not or

if any Israeli if any Jew wants to stay on the settlements they are welcome but

with a Palestinian passport and under the Palestinian Constitution

how can we peace-loving Americans connect with those worldwide who may not

realize they may not realize that many of us are in solidarity as citizens of

this fragile planet well I think you know this is a challenge which I have

always when I visit the Arab world what are the Americans do with the Americans they want to do one two three and always

they look at the Americans from the side of their you know of their administration and their policies we are

trying as churches to tell them the other side of the course the coin that

the American people many a time are not aware of the injustice that is going in the Middle East and we need only such

leaders like President Carter to tell the world wait a minute please understand things

differently however we must also be allies with many churches in the Middle

East and allow our people in the Middle East to know that there are many churches in United States of America

that that dare to sneak their head and work with justice and be in solidarity

with people who are suffering and with the oppressed which the Arab and Muslim

world do not know about them and it's our duty as Palestinian Christians to be

the voice of the Arab and Muslim world to the United States of America and your

voice to the Muslim and Arab world in order that they understand what many

good willing Americans are doing for justice and peace for us this is the reason we are seeking

now at the moment for allies from the Jewish people from the Islamic nations

from the Americans from the Europeans from the Palestinians that can make that

the care that can be alized and our voices for justice and be peace

may become a symphony for justice and peace and reconciliation that can change

the Middle East's one more question I hate it that was a great ending but

there was more question that I wanted to give you I hope this sinfoni will be today the

one last question because as we're going into the annapolis meeting yes I think maybe you can give our audience

something to think about as they're observing that process unfold Yassir

Arafat was blamed for the failure of the first of the second Camp David in the year 2000 how would you how would you

ask us to look at the events as they unfold to ensure that one side is not

blamed if the peace talks fail well the easy game is to blame the other and we

in the Middle East are tired of blaming the other and stigmatizing the other and

demonizing the other and labeling the other this kind of stigmatization is

always there because we with the Palestinians are always on the weaker side and when you are on the weaker side

you see you don't have parents to go there and cry and weep and this is the

reason why and this is the reason we feel like orphans and for this reason we

are afraid and I've spoken with Abu Mazen and I told him you you must do something

you know and in order that these major issues that are the basics for

Palestinians will be addressed in Annapolis you know and I want to again

mention something that if a nopales fails then we moderates will become a

minority in the Middle East because Annapolis did in Annapolis the whole

Muslim and Arab world are saying let us see if Abu Mazen is serious if all mark

is serious if President Bush is serious if they find that Annapolis has been

like other meetings then I'm again afraid that extremism will take over for

me we must really now encourage our leadership to go to Annapolis but also

not to go out of Annapolis except with tangible result that will give justice

for Palestinians and Israelis equally that is my dream at the moment but at

the same time to have in mind land for peace not only the West Bank and Gaza

but also the Golan Heights and Shaba in Lebanon all are a plan that is under

occupation that uh nopales will say it will be returned to the Arabs and

two-state solution and the Arab initiative will be really discussed and

will be implemented only then there will be hope in a hopeless situation thank

you very much

I would like to thank you all for coming out tonight as you're leaving if you're

interested in having more information about the Carter Center programs in the West Bank there is an email list for you

to sign your email we can update you on the Carter centers activities in the West Knight thank you very much for

coming

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