Interview with Lawrence Wong: Writing the next chapter of the Singapore ...

Interview with Lawrence Wong: Writing the next chapter of the Singapore Story

CNA

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184,234 views  May 14, 2024

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Mr Lawrence Wong sits down with six journalists from the media and talks about his plans for Singapore as he prepares to be sworn in on Wednesday (May 15) as the country’s fourth Prime Minister. He touches on a wide range of topics during the interview, including how he was chosen for the top job, as well as his guiding principles in steering the country through an uncertain global environment. 

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More videos on Singapore's leadership handover:

   • Singapore leadership handover   

00:00 Introduction

00:29 Singapore’s social compact

03:47 Choosing public service

08:25 Pandemic challenges

11:20 Taking on the post of Prime Minister

16:07 Reading habits

19:53 Taking Malay language lessons

21:17 Singaporean identity

24:33 Building consensus among Singaporeans 

27:30 Opposition presence 

30:33 Doing things differently, re-examining approaches

32:47 Guiding principles in steering Singapore through choppy waters

37:42 Confidence in Singaporeans

39:35 Observations of the new generation

41:56 Message for young Singaporeans

43:23 Mandarin learning journey

45:39 Role of the government

46:46 Leadership style

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Singapore’s social compact

DPM, I would like to start the conversation  talking a little bit about your background. So   you grew up in a HDB flat; you  attended a neighbourhood school,  

you then worked your way through the civil  service and now you are on the cusp of becoming   Singapore's next Prime Minister. Some people  might say that really embodies what it means  

to be within the Singapore system as well  as Singapore's social compact, if you will. I am the product of the Singapore system.

What is your response? The social compact is in many ways, the  essence of the Singapore Story. It is about  

who we are and the kind of society we want  to be. And I believe all Singaporeans would  

like Singapore to be a place where there are  opportunities for everyone to excel, thrive,  

maximise their potential and be the best possible  version of themselves. But everyone is different.  

We all have different abilities and strengths.  We learn at different paces, so recognising that,  

I think this pursuit of our dream, it is not  about comparing with one another and ending  

up in some endless rat race. But it is really  about understanding what our strengths are,  

what paths each one of us might choose,  and in the end, embracing these different,  

multiple pathways of success. But to make this happen,  

we must have a system and a society where every  job is respected, where there is fair pay for  

every job. And we recognise people for each one of their contributions. It is not a hierarchy;  

it is not about status, because people will  succeed in different ways. And we must embrace all  

these different pathways and these different roles  and contributions that everyone in society makes.

At the same time, I think part of the compact  is also about having a system where there is  

greater sense of assurance and security for  Singaporeans regarding the basics in life,  

whether it is housing, education, healthcare,  retirement. So whatever path they choose,  

whatever job they pursue, so long as they work  consistently, they can be assured of these basics  

through every life stage. And they can also be  assured that if they were to fall into troubles,  

or some inevitable setbacks in life, they will be  able to bounce back stronger. And this assurance,  

this support, has to be provided not just  by the government alone, but it also has to   be provided by all of us in society, so  that we feel a sense of shared responsibility to  

one another, and we can grow as a more gracious,  more generous, more big-hearted society. 

So, I think these are the key elements of what we  would like Singapore to be. These are captured in  

the Forward Singapore report after we have engaged  with many Singaporeans, and we certainly will  

take steps towards strengthening this compact  and shaping this future Singapore together.

Choosing public service

I mean, that has been quite a prominent message  across the past couple of years in your political  

career. But even before that, you started off  as a civil servant, before taking the leap into   politics. I just wanted to understand what your  motivations for that were. And maybe on a related  

note, how much has your life changed since then,  and now that you are about to become the Prime Minister, how much more are you prepared to show  of yourself on a personal level to Singaporeans? 

I entered politics because I saw it as a  continuation of public service, and I have  

over the years found my calling in public service. It was not the case when I started out to work  

to be fair. When I started working, I was an  economist in the Ministry of Trade and Industry. 

I had been rejected by the Public Service  Commission to be in the administrative service,   so I was not doing a lot of, I was  not involved in a lot of policy work. 

My work was largely around  economic analysis I would be the quant, so to speak, or the guy  doing all the analytical work. Somebody has  

an issue, you want to analyse what happens  to the economy under these circumstances. 

There is a regional financial crisis.  What is going to happen to Singapore?  Well, you ask me the question, I will run  my models, I will do the technical number  

crunching and I will give you the output. That was a lot of the work that I was   involved in at the start of my career. And when I was looking at myself,  

I was looking at friends around me and other  schoolmates and peers, I figured, look,  

I can do economics work in the government. I can do exactly the same kind of economics   work in the private sector too  and they are paying better. 

So the thought did cross my mind.  Maybe I should just leave and join   a private sector, maybe a bank. But at that time, I also had very  

good bosses in the civil service. Khaw Boon Wan happened to be my first permanent secretary

in MTI and then Lim Siong Guan in  Finance, and they persuaded me to stay on. 

And they said, look, if you go, I mean, you  are only involved in doing economics work now,  

but if you stay on, you may get  exposure to other kinds of work,   doing policy work and you will find the  work more meaningful and more interesting. 

So I took their advice, I stayed on and indeed it  was the case because after a while, I got involved  

in working in budgets. I got involved in working  in policy work. I got involved in even going out  

into the community to explain budget initiatives. And I found all of that very meaningful  

because it's, that is the kind of work I would  not have been able to do in the private sector.  So I decided I do not have to leave. In fact, I  did not want to leave. I stayed on and each time,  

you know, as I stayed on in the public service,  each responsibility I got became progressively  

larger and larger, and the work never shrinks.  The work just gets bigger and bigger. And  

in 2011, when Prime Minister Lee invited me to  enter politics, I said, look, this is my calling.  

I have decided that being in public service is  what I would like to do. And so I saw entering  

politics as a continuation of that. And that  is why I have been in politics since then.  So it is altogether 15 years in the civil  service and about 13 years in politics now,  

nearly 30 years of public service.  I do not regret that at all. I found  

the journey very meaningful, very fulfilling. And being in politics, of course, is different  

from being a civil servant. You know that when  you enter into politics, while there is a public   service element to it, it is also different  because there is political contestation. You  

have to open yourself up to the public and you  have to be prepared for that. So I was prepared   for that when I entered politics. The good thing  in Singapore is that I think where politics is  

concerned, while there is exposure, while you have  to put yourself up to the public and there is less  

privacy, I think generally we keep families out  of it. Families are separate. Our families did  

not choose to be politicians. We are the ones who  took the step forward. And so people generally  

respect that, and that is a good thing. But as far as I am concerned, I have made   the choice. I have entered politics. And so as I  take on this new responsibility, if people would  

like to ask more information of me, find out  more about me, I will be very happy to share.

Pandemic challenges

Speaking about, you know,  getting people to know you,   I think it is fair to say that you shot  to prominence when you co-chaired the  

multi-ministerial task force on COVID-19. What  were some of your biggest challenges? You know,  

what kept you awake at night during the pandemic  as you were co-chairing this task force? The beginning was very difficult, because at  the beginning we were really fighting in the  

fog of war. I mean, we did not have a lot  of information, what the virus was about. 

There was no vaccine. And you could see as we learned more,  

how horrifying it was because the fatality  rate was high, was higher than the normal flu,  

and it was spreading so quickly. So at that beginning, I think the biggest   challenge was what happened with the dormitories  and the huge wave of infection that caught up one  

dormitory after another, and the very real  risk of our hospitals becoming overwhelmed. 

Because if that were to happen, then you could see  in many other places the death rates will shoot  

up very sharply. So we were very concerned. That was probably one of the most difficult  

periods, including the decision to introduce  the circuit breaker. And also the sort of  

really almost desperate, or you could say,  we were really just looking at ways to find  

additional capacity to strengthen and augment  our hospitals. And that is why it was so good  

to see people rallying together, private  sector, everyone working together and we   got the Expo facility set up and we were  able to eventually stabilise the situation. 

So that was one very difficult  situation that I remember.  The second I suppose, difficult, not quite  the same, but still very challenging,  

was when we had to reintroduce measures. If you remember, because this was first wave,  

everyone, very difficult, challenging.  Then we went through that, vaccines. But   then when we went through yet another  new wave, variants, and then when we  

had to reintroduce some of these restrictions. And this went through some ups and downs too,  

because we introduced and then we allowed some  relaxation and then after that we realised,  

went too far, we had to reintroduce. That bumpiness and that sort of having  

to explain to Singaporeans why, how we manage  the balance, right, we want to get our lives  

back to normal, but we also have to make sure  that we do not overwhelm the hospital system. 

That was also very challenging.  That was the second part, I think,   nearer to the second part of the COVID period. But that was also a very difficult period for us,  

more so, to explain to the public because  they were getting frustrated, and more so,   to make sure that everyone understands  our approach towards tackling COVID. 

Taking on the post of Prime Minister

DPM we just heard about your thought process in  deciding to join politics. You also shared before  

your decision in agreeing to become the next  Prime Minister. Just wondering between the two,  

what were the differences? Was there a  different kind of struggle that you have   to cope and also wondering what was Mrs Wong’s  reaction when you agreed to be the next PM.

It is similar, and yet it is different. Similar,  because it is still very much a continuation,  

in my mind of public service. Different, because obviously   this is a much bigger step forward. From a civil servant to entering politics,  

first of all, when I made that shift, it was not  about, oh, I am making the shift to be a minister. 

You do not know what role you take on when  you enter politics. No one tells you, right?  

So you just know that you are entering politics  and only later they assign you an appointment. 

And I started out as a Minister  of State. And that transition was,  

I mean, there was a transition, adjustment  to be made, but I knew what I was getting   myself into. I had worked with many office  holders in the past as a civil servant. 

I knew what the job entailed,  and I was prepared for it.  From a minister to a Prime Minister, yes, you are  first amongst equals, but I had seen also how much  

the scale of responsibilities, what it entailed  and how much, what was involved in this job. 

It is not just about one ministry, one GRC. Now you are talking about national  

responsibilities, leading the party into  elections. So it was a much bigger role.  And I had to ask myself whether it  was something I was prepared to do. 

But I suppose what happened, at that time, was  when Swee Keat decided to step down. It was a  

difficult decision for him, but we accepted it. But it was also, as a consequence of that,   the team had to get together, the rest of us  amongst the younger ministers, the 4G team,  

and ask ourselves, how do we proceed?  How do we, amongst us, choose a leader? 

And we agreed very early on, that we  would not want to rule anyone out. We  

would want to have a more open and thorough  process so that we choose amongst ourselves,  

who might be the leader and whoever that person  is, we would rally and support that person. 

And so on that basis, I agreed, or I reflected  on it and I felt that it is, that is the best  

way forward. I should not rule myself out.  I should let the process take its course.   Then the question was, how do you go about  this process and as you would have known,  

we decided we might do it differently  rather than what we had done in the past.  We might find someone to help facilitate  this. Really talk to everyone in the team,  

get views and do it in a way that would help us  get the answer, select the best person to lead  

the team, but also bring the team together. And eventually when we discussed with Prime Minister,   he decided to ask Khaw Boon Wan  to do the job and that is why Boon Wan  

went about interviewing all, each one of us. As he was going about the interviews, Boon Wan  

was very careful. He did not let on at all, who,  you know, might have emerged from the process. 

Not at all. I mean, he was interviewing me. I  told him my views. He listened and he asked me  

some questions and then at the end of it, he said,  there is a consensus emerging. And that is all. 

I did not think very much of it. He did not tell  me who it was. I did not ask. I did not probe.   All he said was, he has done about half of the  interviews and there is a consensus emerging. 

So I did not think very much of it  because my view throughout that process,   was let the process run its course. The team will  choose. I did not know who it might be. I did not  

care to probe. And Boon Wan was very careful.  He did not tell anyone. The only time I knew  

was at the tail end of the process, when he had  pretty much completed his rounds. And then when  

PM and him told me, that I had been selected. So naturally at that time I was surprised. When  

I went back home to tell my wife she was  surprised too. But we had been prepared  

for it because she knew I was part of this  process and we knew that going into this,  

we would accept the outcome of the process. And if this is the result, then I would step  

up and I would take on the responsibility. And that is why I am here, where I am now.

Reading habits

So we also know that you love to read books.  Just wondering whether you would have a list of  

must-read for different groups of people,  and also out of the books that you read,  

do they actually help to shape your  thoughts and also your approaches,   as well as whether there are some characters  in some books that you admire most?

I do not have a must-read list. I read widely.  I think many ministers do. It is not just me.  

I read mostly non-fiction these days. A lot  of it is current affairs. From time to time,  

I would select topics that I would  like to read more, learn more about.  So some of the more recent topics in, you  know, trying to figure out more about quantum  

computing, artificial intelligence. So I just read some books on that. 

And then I do read biographies of leaders,  local and foreign. So whether it is Mr Lee,  

but not just Mr Lee, Lee Kuan Yew, himself,  you know, books on the founding  

generation of leaders. Goh Keng Swee, Rajaratnam.  Irene’s book on Raja, the first volume is  

very good. And she has just finished her second  volume and I am looking forward to reading it. I  

think she is going to do a launch. She asked me  to be the guest of honour and I happily agreed. 

So, certainly, founding generation of leaders,  I think it is always insightful to read their  

life stories and what they say. And then,  of course, overseas leaders too, I mean,  

and there are a whole range of them, whether  in the region or beyond the region in the West. 

In the US, when I was in college, you know,  we would take classes on political leadership,  

on US Presidents and then you read about, whether  it is Teddy Roosevelt, FDR. And one of the,  

I remember one of the books I read, Eisenhower  and what he had said about leadership that always  

remains with me. He distilled leadership into  two things. One, knowing what to do, and two,  

getting people to do what is the right thing.  And it sounds very simple. It sounds very simple,  

but actually there is a lot of wisdom in there. First, you need to know what to do. Knowing what  

to do does not mean that the leader must  have all the answers. But certainly the  

leader can listen to advice, get views. But  eventually the leader must say this is the  

way forward because if you are not even able  to articulate and express this way forward,   then there is no need for a leader to exist. So knowing what to do is important. But the  

second part is equally important. You have  decided after a process or whatever it is,  

this is the best way forward. How do you get  everyone to come around to agreeing with you and  

bringing everyone on the same page and say, let  us move this way. That is not easy to do too. That  

requires communication. It requires persuasion. It requires ways to inspire people, engage people,  

motivate them, and get everyone on the same  page. And that is just as important. Otherwise,  

the leader will be charging alone. So I think, thinking through these two  

aspects of leadership, how it is actually  manifested and how best to bring to bear  

such leadership skills in every situation is  something that has always remained with me.

Taking Malay language lessons

DPM, in preparation for your role to be the  leader of a country made of multiple races  

and religions. Perhaps you can share  with us a glimpse of how you have been   preparing yourself for the role, perhaps to  be more familiar with the communities here,  

Malay community perhaps. Perhaps you  have been reading more of Berita Harian,   listening more to our podcast or  perhaps taking Malay language lessons?

I am taking Malay language lessons.  I am doing it as best as I can every week. 

It is not something only now. I have been doing it off and on,   for some time. Even before, then as a civil  servant, I did a little bit, conversational,  

as a civil servant. And then after entering  politics, I also continued with it. 

But now ever since the appointment as DPM,  already close to two years, I have been taking  

the lessons more seriously too, because I do  want to engage more in Malay, speak in Malay. 

So it is a continuing process. I think to be  able to deliver a speech, something I can do. 

To be fluent and be able to engage completely  in Malay, I think that will be much,  

much harder. But never say never. I will just  keep on working at it and trying to get better.

Singaporean identity

As Singapore society matures, so does  our identity. And what are some of, what  

is your comment on this evolving  Singaporean identity in terms of  

the different ethnic groups here and maintaining  their cultural, separate cultural identities?

We have a unique Singaporean approach to  this, which is that we value every community,  

big or small, and we want to make  sure that every community has a place,  

is respected, is valued, and feels  a sense of belonging in Singapore,   which means that every community must be able to  continue with their customs, their traditions,  

their own ethnic cultures and never feel like  they are excluded from Singapore society. 

At the same time, we work with all communities  to find common ground to see what is it that  

brings us together as Singaporeans. And  we continually work towards evolving and  

strengthening this sense of Singaporean identity. And this is not a new approach. This has been our  

approach since independence and you can  see the results of it. It is a reason why  

we say a Singaporean Chinese is different  from a Chinese from China, it is likewise  

a Singaporean Malay is different from  someone from the region. A Singaporean   Indian is very different from someone from India. If you listen to the Singapore Chinese orchestra,  

the way they sound is very different from a  Chinese orchestra from China. And same for   our Malay, our Indian, cultural and arts  groups. There is something distinctive  

about that Singaporean tradition. And I think that is something   precious which we must continue to build  upon and it will continue to evolve. 

At the same time, I think we also recognise that  as a diverse society with different ethnic groups,  

we will always be susceptible to external forces,  outside of Singapore and these are powerful  

external forces that can easily influence  different segments of our people, whether  

it is Chinese, Malay or Indian, because these  external links are deep. They are ancestral links,  

they are cultural links, they are very strong  links. And I think they are important because  

they are about who we are and we value them. But even as we maintain these links,  

we must be mindful that we are  first and foremost Singaporeans. 

And while we have these links, we must  continually work towards strengthening   our Singaporean identity and expanding the  common ground that we all share as Singaporeans. 

So this pledge that we talk about every day  to be one united people, regardless of race,  

language or religion, the words in our pledge,  that is a work in progress and it is something  

that we must continue to come together, work  together, to make it a reality every single day.

Building consensus among Singaporeans

DPM, on this note, right at the start of  the interview you talked about the Forward   Singapore exercise and how it is very important  to build a shared consensus. But at the same time,  

there will always be groups that disagree  and they can be quite vocal even after   consensus has been reached. So do  you think your government will,  

you know, change the way that you  manage such dissenting voices?

We are becoming a more diverse society, there  is no doubt about that. I think we will continue   to move in that direction. And so the way  forward is for us to embrace the diversity,  

continue to engage one another and at the  same time, work even harder to find  

unity amidst diversity, to find common ground. From the government’s point of view, we do want  

to open up the space for different groups to be  involved in shaping our future. We take this very  

seriously. That is why, you know, in our Forward  Singapore engagements, we engage many different   groups. That is why we are also creating new  platforms for people, not just to give their  

views but to participate in decision-making. We  have youth panels. We have alliances for action.  

We have created a Singapore partnership office. So we are creating more and more platforms   for Singaporeans to be involved. There will be instances, of course,  

where we have to agree to disagree, because  there will be differences in views. There will be  

instances where the government, after sounding out  different segments, may have to embark on policies  

that are not so popular, but we think necessary  and important for Singapore and for Singaporeans. 

And in such instances, then the government  will have to carry the decision. We will   have to explain, engage with the public why  we think this is important and hopefully be  

able to persuade Singaporeans to move along. There will also be instances where there are  

sensitive issues where different  groups have different views and  

sometimes competing contradictory views. And in those instances, it may be that the  

government does not have to always take the  lead, but our role is more of a facilitator,  

a listener, an honest broker. And we find ways to get the  

different groups to come together, engage  one another, listen to each other’s views   and to find accommodation and compromise. And then think about what is the best way for  

Singapore to move forward without fracturing  our society. So there will be these sorts of  

issues that we will have to deal with. And I think our approach in Singapore   is one where we embrace diversity. We do not  accentuate our differences, but we find always,  

ways to accommodate, compromise and  move forward together as one people.

Opposition presence

On that note, you said recently yourself  the opposition is here to stay. There is an  

appetite for greater political contestation. But  the government also emphasises that, you know,  

Singapore's success is built on the success  of the PAP, and that once this is lost,  

it is not something that can go back. So  how do you balance between these two things? The opposition presence is certainly here to stay. We accept that. It is going to be a permanent  

feature in our political system. In the past when  you think about the days of PAP dominance under  

Mr Lee Kuan Yew, those days are over. I am sure going forward,   all seats will be contested. The opposition now says they want to win  

at least one-third of the seats in parliament. But in fact, if you look at the last election   results, there are quite a number of hotly  contested seats. And if you were to take  

not just the Workers’ Party but other, one or two  other opposition parties, if in the next election  

the contest is fiercer and we were to lose just  a few percentage points, it is not unimaginable  

for two or maybe three opposition parties to come  together, form a coalition and run the government.  

Get more than 50%. Not at all unimaginable. And that is why when I said that I do not  

assume the PAP will win the next election  or that I will automatically be the PM   after the election, I say that seriously. This is the reality of our political situation  

today. It is no longer a dominant system, one  party system. It is a system where there are  

alternative voices in parliament, where there are  diverse views that can be heard on any issue. And  

it is a system where there is consent, but there  has to be a mandate and effective governance  

for whoever is given the mandate. That is what we hope to preserve,   that this will continue to be a system  where a mandate is given to the ruling  

party and the ruling party is able to govern  Singapore in the best interests of its people. 

Of course, on my part as leader, as Prime  Minister and later leader of the party,   I will do my very best to make sure that  the PAP earns the confidence and trust of  

Singaporeans and we get the mandate to govern. But if along the way, who knows how long,  

but down the road if, we hope not, this will not  happen, but if it does happen that the PAP is  

not able to deliver up to the standards that  Singaporeans expect of us and an alternative  

party or parties emerge that can offer a better  answer, then they deserve to get the mandate. 

But so long as it is under my watch, I will do  everything I can to make sure that the PAP earns  

the confidence and trust of Singaporeans. So a few weeks ago during your doorstop,   you also talked about how we need to reexamine  and refresh our approaches and also relook certain  

Doing things differently, re-examining approaches

things that we might want to change. So if that  is the case, do you have any specifics on what you  

might want to relook as Prime Minister? Are there  any sacred cows you are prepared to slay perhaps?

We are prepared to relook everything.  And we are prepared to, I mean,  

it is not so much that we are going to  slay a sacred cow for the sake of doing so,   but we are prepared to re-examine all  our assumptions and consider under  

different circumstances, different  societal expectations and needs,  How might we do things different. And we have  already started this process, because the  

Forward Singapore work has already started. We  have done things like updating the definitions  

of public housing. That was a big move. We have put in place significant and  

substantial improvements to SkillsFuture. And  soon we will be announcing the new details of  

the unemployment benefits scheme, which we talked  about, which, you know, we in the past had said  

this was not something we will do. But again, now  under different circumstances, recognising that  

the economic environment is going to be more  volatile, that the pace of change will be faster,  

technological advancements are continuing, and  therefore jobs will be disrupted more and more. 

We feel it is necessary to have some support  system in place. And that is why we are doing   it and we are designing it in such a way that  it will allow people who are unemployed to get  

new skills, a new wave of learning, not  as a burden, not for grades, but really  

to give them a second boost in their careers. And then hopefully they will be able to get a   better job after that. So it is one illustration  of how we are prepared to re-examine all our  

fundamental assumptions and consider ultimately,  what is the best way to take Singapore forward.

Guiding principles in steering Singapore through choppy waters

Okay. So moving forward. Over the years,  Singapore has overcome several challenges  

and we have grown from strength to strength. And we have, like you have mentioned very  

accurately, our stance has always been  pro-Singapore. But having said that,  

we do acknowledge that external  events do impact our nation.  So my question to you is, given that  the external environment right now is  

filled with uncertainty and there are countries  advocating for their own nationalistic interests,  

what are your biggest concerns for Singapore  at this point in time? And also, what are your  

guiding principles in steering Singapore through  these choppy waters towards the right direction?

The external environment indeed is a big concern  for us because even as we go about leadership  

transition and entering our next phase of  development, we are doing so at a time when  

the world is changing. And it is going to be a new  global order which is likely to be very messy and  

unpredictable because the world is in flux. The unipolar moment for America has ended.  

Everybody talks about going into a multipolar  world, but it is not quite at a stable equilibrium   yet. And this period of transition will be  very messy. It will be marked by nationalism,  

protectionism, excessive nationalism.  I mean, nationalism itself is not a bad   thing, but excessive nationalism, very  aggressive nationalism, protectionism,  

rivalry between the major powers. The pattern of globalisation that  

we have benefitted from in the last 30 years will  also be very different. And Singapore being such  

an open economy with trade three times the size  of our GDP, we will certainly be impacted. But it  

does not mean that it is all doom and gloom,  because amidst this challenging environment,   there will be opportunities and there will be  silver linings in the dark clouds because Asia  

is still where I think the centre of gravity  of the global economy will be, in Asia. 

That is where most of the growth for the  global economy will come from. And a lot  

of companies therefore want to be sited in  Asia. A lot of international multinational  

companies still want to have presence in Asia and  they want to diversify their exposure in Asia,  

not just in China or any one single country. They would like to look at broadening their  

exposure, derisking, diversifying and therefore  ASEAN becomes an attractive proposition. And that  

is why, within ASEAN, Singapore also has I think a  very high level of international reputation today.  

We are admired. We are trusted. And companies do  want to do business out of Singapore, to service,  

not only ASEAN, but the wider Asian region. So if we, you know, make the right moves,  

if we strengthen ASEAN integration and  unity, I think we can continue to thrive  

and excel even in a dark and troubled world.  We still can make a good living for ourselves. 

Of course, navigating this new environment will  require us to be more thoughtful, quite careful,  

to be nimble, and to find ways to not get  caught up in the geopolitical currents. 

But you ask what are the guiding principles for  that? At the end of the day, we have to be guided  

by what is in Singapore’s national interest. And  do so in a way that is consistent and principled. 

And that means from time to time, we will  have to say things or do things that some  

countries may not be so happy with. It could  be China one day, it could be US another day.  We not here to find a balance between the two. So  if one day I take a position against one country,  

the next day I have to find another thing  to say for the other country so that I can   somehow achieve some perceived balance.  That is not our approach. Our approach  

is to stick to our national interests  and act in a way that is consistent and  

principled. And doing so will, you know, not  everyone will like what we say all the time,  

but I think if we continue with this approach,  it will make us a more credible and trusted  

partner over time because people know what we  stand for. People know what Singapore means.  

And I think they will be better prepared to  partner with us and work together with us.

Thank you. So the next question that I have for  you is, in the past, Singapore government has  

Confidence in Singaporeans

looked at other advanced economies for  new ideas and for latest technological  

developments. But at this point in time, I think  Singapore has a cutting edge in many areas.  

I mean, of course there is work in progress, but  at this point in time, given the situation that  

we have an edge in many areas, do you believe  and are you confident that the government has  

and will have the talent to actually write many  more successful chapters in our Singapore Story?

I am confident, not just in the government,  but in Singaporeans. I think in the end it is   up to us to move forward in this new phase. You are right that in this new phase we are  

entering it at a much higher level than  we used to. We are in a much stronger  

position today than ever in the past. Our economy is already at a high level  

of development. And if you look at any area  of society, housing, healthcare, education,  

transport, and then you benchmark,  you find indicators to benchmark,   we probably rank quite high in each one of these. In the past, we could come up with a broad  

statement like Swiss standard of living. It is  very hard to identify one single benchmark today. 

So in this new phase, we  are in uncharted territory. 

We have to find our way forward. We have to  still learn from the best, find best practices,  

but we have to break new ground. We have to find fresh solutions  

for our problems and challenges. And  that is what I will endeavour to do,   not just with my team, but by harnessing  the collective energies of all Singaporeans.

Observations of the new generation

DPM, let us talk about the  future generations of Singapore.  We have met many young Singaporeans during  the Forward Singapore engagements. What  

are some of your observations that give you  hope and confidence in this new generation?

I am confident and hopeful because the  sense of Singaporean identity is growing  

amongst younger Singaporeans I engage. They are confident about who they   are and proud to be Singaporeans. And you saw that certainly during  

the last few years when we had  to tackle COVID together as well.  Young Singaporeans, responding to the very  difficult restrictions that we had to impose,  

but also doing their part to  help their fellow Singaporeans.  I am also hopeful because I see many young  Singaporeans now, certainly much more well  

informed than I was when I was their age. They  read a lot more widely. They get access to all  

sorts of information and they are clearer  about what they would like to do in life. 

But I also, you know, from the conversations,  get a sense that they would like to contribute,  

not just to their own careers, but they would like  to contribute to something larger than themselves,  

to a larger purpose. And I think that is very  meaningful. That is a good and positive sign.  

Many of them say they want to go beyond  the 5Cs, you know, the 5Cs of the Singapore   dream of the past. And they would like to  achieve something larger than themselves. 

When I said that or when we talked about  that in the Forward Singapore report,   there were critics who said oh, that means  that young Singaporeans cannot aspire towards  

the Singapore dream of 5Cs anymore. But that  is not the case. I think that is misconstrued  

and that is completely inaccurate. I mean, young  Singaporeans want to have a good life. But they  

want not just the good life to be measured  by narrow metrics based on material success,  

they are looking for meaning. They are looking  for fulfilment. They are looking for purpose.   I think these are very noble aspirations. And certainly we will do our part in the  

government to support these aspirations and  help young Singaporeans to realise that.

Thank you. You also recently shared a letter   from a 7-year-old girl named Faith who shared  her appreciation and excitement towards your  

Message for young Singaporeans

leadership. My children, too, are equally excited. Oh, I am glad to hear that.  Curious about, and these are my son’s  words, “the new principal of Singapore”. 

Principal. Yah. Faith and my,   I think my kids are, they are part of the post Lee  Kuan Yew generation who may not fully appreciate  

the journey Singapore has taken thus far. DPM, what do you wish to say to a   young Singaporean who is watching your  swearing-in as the fourth PM of Singapore?

Well, I would say that, you  know, we have come a long way   as a country these last 60 years. We have fought incredible odds. 

We have defied incredible odds to  achieve this miracle called Singapore.  It is a transformation  beyond anyone’s imagination. 

Now we are in a new phase of Singapore’s  development but in fact, the best chapters  

of the Singapore story are yet to be written. And all of us, but especially the young  

generation, people like your kids and Faith, they  are going to be the authors of this next chapter.  

So I would call on all of them to work with me  and my team to write the next chapter together. 

Thank you. DPM, can I follow up   on one question. You mentioned about you  learning Malay, but what about Chinese?

Mandarin learning journey

How about Mandarin? Yah. How advanced are you now? Because  I understand even from grassroots,   they have been singing a lot of praises  for your command of the language.

Well, I also continue with Mandarin  lessons. In the last one or two years,  

probably not as frequently as Malay, because  I have had to bring up my Malay to a better   level. So focusing on Malay. But I do continue  with my Mandarin lessons from time to time. 

With Mandarin, it is different. It is not so much  about learning a language from very low levels.  

With Mandarin, after all, I have studied Mandarin  in school all my life. Also struggled with  

studying Mandarin in school all my life. But I  have had the foundations in me. It is just that I  

did not have the benefit of growing up in a family  environment where we speak Mandarin regularly. 

So it is very interesting because when I  compare with some friends who have that kind   of an environment, they are more confident  in speaking Mandarin on a day-to-day basis,  

yet when we talk about writing, and  reading, and understanding of words,  

somehow my foundations are better than theirs  because I took Mandarin classes seriously. 

I studied Mandarin seriously and so  therefore my reading, writing is,   the foundations are all there. So to me, with  Mandarin it is about just using it more regularly.  

It is about gaining confidence over time.  Using it not just on a conversational basis. 

With my residents, it is not difficult to do that  on a conversational basis, but to start using it,  

going beyond that conversational Mandarin to  using it for work, using it for interviews,  

using it for even, you know, engagements  with others, that is a higher level or that  

is my next phase in my Mandarin journey and  I hope I will continue to get better at it.

Role of the government

DPM, I want to bring up a point that you  made just now about how you see governance.   You mentioned that in future for more difficult  issues or some difficult issues, the government  

is prepared to play the role of a facilitator. Not in future, I think we have always been   doing it and we will continue to do so. 

Are there particular areas that you think is more suited to this aspect of governance? Well, we have had to deal with this in sensitive  issues like the tudong and 377A in the past. 

I do not know what new issues will emerge,  but there will be. There will continue to   be issues like that down the road, I am  sure, where there will be different views  

among different segments of the community. And in some of these instances, not all,  

in some of these instances, the government does  not necessarily have to lead from the front,  

because some of these instances, the social  norms have to evolve more organically.  The government therefore, its role is not so  much to say, this is the way, but to facilitate,  

to bring people together, to find consensus  on how best to move forward as a people.

I would like to ask. During the COVID-19 pandemic,  I believe many Singaporeans still remember the  

Leadership style

visual of you expressing your appreciation to the  unsung heroes who fought hard during the pandemic. 

It really struck a chord with many people.  So I think the human side of you, you know,  

you really showed that so beautifully. So in a  recent interview, when you were asked about how  

would you govern Singapore, you mentioned  that if you have to take hard decisions   in the interest of Singapore, you would do that. So can we say that you would lead Singapore with  

an iron fist encased with velvet gloves or how  best would you describe your leadership style?

Well, it is what I have described already, which  is that I will listen, I will engage widely. 

But at the end of the day, I will have to  carry the final decisions and bear the ultimate  

responsibility of decisions taken. And when I  do so, I will have to explain to the public,  

especially when it comes down to the  decisions that may not be so popular, but   the government feels are important for Singapore. And I think Singaporeans have seen me doing that,  

time and again during COVID or in the Budget. So they know that, you know, as far as my  

leadership style is concerned, I will  be open, consultative, I will listen,  

but in the end I will not shirk from doing the  right thing and the important decisions that  

are necessary to take Singapore forward. So that is how I would describe myself. 

I do not know if that means iron fist in velvet  gloves or whatever other metaphor you want to use,  

but I think over time Singaporeans will get  a better sense of me and my leadership style. 

And, you know, these things will play out  and time will tell. I do not have to write  

my legacy today. I think hopefully  at the end of my time and my tenure,  

I will leave people to write my legacy  and what kind of a Prime Minister I am. 

But for now, entering this role  and taking on this responsibility,   I will only endeavour to do my best and to serve  with all my heart, Singapore and Singaporeans.

DPM, thank you very much for joining us  today for this interview. We appreciate the   time as well as the insights that you’ve  shared with us. So thank you once again. 

Thank you. Thank you everyone. Thank you.